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Post by sharon2306 on Dec 8, 2011 23:19:50 GMT
If I posted now you would be so appalled you would throw me off the forum! Actually, I do find that when I haven't looked at the novel (it's been a week now) my confidence in it dips quite dramatically. I start feeling panicky and thinking it's rubbish. I would really like to know how authors pluck up the courage to put their work "out there". The truth is, I have never let anyone read anything I have ever written apart from when I had to show it to my tutor at the OU. I know for a fact that my biggest problem is going to be my over sensitivity and my thin skin, because writers have to deal with criticism, bad reviews and lots of rejection. How?? I am shaking just thinking of it. That's why I never post anything and couldn't even contemplate sharing any of this first draft with anyone. I would have to work and work on it before I could even send it to an editor. It's kind of like the people who clean their houses till they gleam because the cleaner's coming round that day! I would love to know where authors get their confidence from.
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Post by ottabelle on Dec 9, 2011 5:09:09 GMT
You show people more. That's the only thing I can think of. And maybe we never get over it fully. Confidence comes from within. You, I'm sure, have a gem. If you're worried about it, there is something great there, in my experience. It's when you're not so worried about it and think it's probably pretty great and nothing is wrong with it that there's probably a problem. (Unless it's already been through the wringer a few times.) You can always start here, I think we're all nice. I think I'll put my money where my mouth is. I'll post my first five chapters, which is about half of the current work, and I want everyone to rip it apart.
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Post by limebirdwriters on Dec 9, 2011 9:01:57 GMT
If I posted now you would be so appalled you would throw me off the forum! Actually, I do find that when I haven't looked at the novel (it's been a week now) my confidence in it dips quite dramatically. I start feeling panicky and thinking it's rubbish. I would really like to know how authors pluck up the courage to put their work "out there". The truth is, I have never let anyone read anything I have ever written apart from when I had to show it to my tutor at the OU. I know for a fact that my biggest problem is going to be my over sensitivity and my thin skin, because writers have to deal with criticism, bad reviews and lots of rejection. How?? I am shaking just thinking of it. That's why I never post anything and couldn't even contemplate sharing any of this first draft with anyone. I would have to work and work on it before I could even send it to an editor. It's kind of like the people who clean their houses till they gleam because the cleaner's coming round that day! I would love to know where authors get their confidence from. Sharon, I can completely see where you are coming from. It took me quite a lot to post that short story on the blog yesterday. Even though I only wrote it quickly and to show characterisation, I still didn't feel that confident. Then this morning I woke up to find that someone had sent me a very long critique of it, basically ripping it to shreds and now my confidence has been knocked. So, I don't know if I'm the best person to give advice as I am exactly the same as you! Can anyone else give any advice to Sharon?
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Post by loupy on Dec 9, 2011 10:02:40 GMT
If I posted now you would be so appalled you would throw me off the forum! Actually, I do find that when I haven't looked at the novel (it's been a week now) my confidence in it dips quite dramatically. I start feeling panicky and thinking it's rubbish. I would really like to know how authors pluck up the courage to put their work "out there". The truth is, I have never let anyone read anything I have ever written apart from when I had to show it to my tutor at the OU. I know for a fact that my biggest problem is going to be my over sensitivity and my thin skin, because writers have to deal with criticism, bad reviews and lots of rejection. How?? I am shaking just thinking of it. That's why I never post anything and couldn't even contemplate sharing any of this first draft with anyone. I would have to work and work on it before I could even send it to an editor. It's kind of like the people who clean their houses till they gleam because the cleaner's coming round that day! I would love to know where authors get their confidence from. Sharon, I can completely see where you are coming from. It took me quite a lot to post that short story on the blog yesterday. Even though I only wrote it quickly and to show characterisation, I still didn't feel that confident. Then this morning I woke up to find that someone had sent me a very long critique of it, basically ripping it to shreds and now my confidence has been knocked. So, I don't know if I'm the best person to give advice as I am exactly the same as you! Can anyone else give any advice to Sharon? Seriously? I'm in NO way an expert on stuff like this...but...there will always be people who don't like what you've written. Just take Stephen King for instance, he spent years sending in short stories to magazines and other publications and only received rejection after rejection. He had so many that he put them on a post in his room, and used them sort of as encouragement. I think even his college professors told him his work was bad, I can't remember though. Anyway, the point is, he spent years getting rejected and being told his work was no good and look at him now! I'm sure he's laughing in all of their faces! I would be the same way though, if someone told me something I did was bad, I'd take it badly. I recently entered a screenwriting competition where out of 25 possible points, I got 3 points. I knew my script wasn't amazing, but I thought it was better than basically a 0. Anyway, I didn't want to move on to the next round of the competition, but my husband basically told me to buck up and do it, and so I submitted to the second round of the competition. I don't know how I did on it, but I'm glad I at least tried, and I know had I not tried I'd be feeling bad about myself now. Anyway, I dunno if anything i"m saying is helping or makes any sense at all... but basically moral of the story is don't listen to the naysayers - I saw a lot of positive comments pointed your way on your story posting missy!
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Post by limebirdwriters on Dec 9, 2011 10:07:45 GMT
Thanks Laura, that's kind I know, I do appreciate all of the positive comments, but it's weird isn't it, how you always focus on the bad ones. Thing is, he completely missed the point of the exercise, so I need to make sure I don't focus too much on that. I set up Limebird for it to be a safe place where people could encourage each other to become better writers. However, the comments I was sent were so harsh, that I think that if those comments had been sent to a beginner writer, it would have really affected them badly. I guess if we want to be successful writers, we have to develop very thick skins!
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Post by loupy on Dec 9, 2011 11:41:17 GMT
Oy yeah, it's hard to focus on anything good when you have bad comments. It's hard to forget them too.
I say crumple up his comments into a tiny corner of your brain and completely forget about them.
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Post by limebirdwriters on Dec 9, 2011 11:45:39 GMT
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Post by 4amWriter on Dec 9, 2011 12:16:20 GMT
Haha, yeah I know but you guys actually, you know, have lots of experience and have more tips for different kinds of people. I just have ideas for me. And they don't always transfer to other people and I leave them with more confusion, after trying to explain how I know how to do something. Sharon: Post post post! 4am: How do you know when you need to seek out a professional? Do you need to every time before sending a book off? And thanks That actually made me feel really good. You both made me feel really good, actually. o: Editing can be fun, or it can be "urgh". Funny, true story: Essays I've written so far in college, which has only been about 6 but I'm just a.. sophomore I think. I think I have enough credits to be considered that. Anyway, I rarely give them a really strong edit after I write it and type it. I just hate looking at it again. I print if off, go over it and then fix it and that's it. I had a cool comp teacher, if you kept making the same mistake you only got counted off once. My most common mistake was to switch tense. I actually forgot about that until now, I'll need to pay attention for that. Awww, you're so sweet! I'm glad that you're having a positive experience on these forums. That makes me feel good! As far as knowing when to seek out a professional, I suggest doing it after you have written at least 3 drafts and you have had someone else (beta reader or a writing group) read it. I also suggest that you hire someone because you are serious about getting it published. Sometimes we think we're ready for the "big leagues" and we're really not--for various reasons. The last thing you want to do is get your ms edited only to find out you're not happy with the material you wrote. That's actually why having someone else read it before you go the editing route is really helpful. Once you're an established author with solid presence in the field, you may not have to hire an editor anymore. Your publishing company may do it in-house. Of course, it really depends on your location and which house you're working with, and whether they even offer in-house editing. You know, you may end up building a really close relationship with your editor (once you start working with one). Lots of times I will end up editing random pages for free for a few of my clients because of a time crunch, or I'll give them a deeper discount depending on the project. This is a good thing, because that means you have found someone you work well with, who you trust, and who is serious about helping you make a successful career.
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Post by 4amWriter on Dec 9, 2011 12:30:28 GMT
If I posted now you would be so appalled you would throw me off the forum! Actually, I do find that when I haven't looked at the novel (it's been a week now) my confidence in it dips quite dramatically. I start feeling panicky and thinking it's rubbish. I would really like to know how authors pluck up the courage to put their work "out there". The truth is, I have never let anyone read anything I have ever written apart from when I had to show it to my tutor at the OU. I know for a fact that my biggest problem is going to be my over sensitivity and my thin skin, because writers have to deal with criticism, bad reviews and lots of rejection. How?? I am shaking just thinking of it. That's why I never post anything and couldn't even contemplate sharing any of this first draft with anyone. I would have to work and work on it before I could even send it to an editor. It's kind of like the people who clean their houses till they gleam because the cleaner's coming round that day! I would love to know where authors get their confidence from. Sharon, I stopped writing for years because a person very dear to me told me I would never get published. I believed him. When my daughter was born, I was (and still am) lucky to be able to stay at home to raise her. During her naptimes I found myself fiddling around on the laptop with just random things. Before I knew it, I was rewriting a story that I had abandoned from years before. When my son was born, I was writing full-tilt. I suddenly realized how I was able to go back to a passion of mine that had once seemed impossible. It's because of my kids. I'm raising children. I'm doing something that not everyone in this world is capable of doing, or doing well. That's when I knew I could do anything if it mattered enough to me. My children inspired me and got me out of my funk just enough to remind me that the only person who stopped me was me. I chose to listen to someone tell me I was a terrible writer. That was my choice, my mistake. When I realized that I can raise happy, healthy, generous, kindhearted kids--that's an amazing accomplishment. Why shouldn't I also be able to write novels? Sharon, it is natural to not feel confident when you're starting out with something like this. Writing is like baring your soul. It's extremely tough to do. But you have to make a conscious decision that you are going to do it because you love it. You will withstand the bad reviews and the rejections and the negativity. You will try harder and learn more and write better. You have to truly believe in yourself. Because you are the only one who makes it happen, in the end. Trust me, it does get easier. I swear to you that it does. But you absolutely have to have the determination and the perseverence to get through the rocky times. It also helps to have a wonderful support group cheering you on. Anyway, that's me chiming in.
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Post by 4amWriter on Dec 9, 2011 18:19:02 GMT
Sharon, I can completely see where you are coming from. It took me quite a lot to post that short story on the blog yesterday. Even though I only wrote it quickly and to show characterisation, I still didn't feel that confident. Then this morning I woke up to find that someone had sent me a very long critique of it, basically ripping it to shreds and now my confidence has been knocked. So, I don't know if I'm the best person to give advice as I am exactly the same as you! Beth, What do you mean that someone ripped your short story to shreds? What did they say? I find this very disturbing because you didn't put it up there for a critique. Maybe I shouldn't get all hot under the collar about this, but I am... My view on your post is this: you were doing an experiment based on gender-neutral language and characterization. You did a great job in getting us to think about words and what they convey and how we sometimes can get in the way of interpretation. Whatever the critter said, he/she missed the point you were making. Your writing style/technique/skill is not in question here, IMO. Kate
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Post by ottabelle on Dec 9, 2011 18:53:48 GMT
If I posted now you would be so appalled you would throw me off the forum! Actually, I do find that when I haven't looked at the novel (it's been a week now) my confidence in it dips quite dramatically. I start feeling panicky and thinking it's rubbish. I would really like to know how authors pluck up the courage to put their work "out there". The truth is, I have never let anyone read anything I have ever written apart from when I had to show it to my tutor at the OU. I know for a fact that my biggest problem is going to be my over sensitivity and my thin skin, because writers have to deal with criticism, bad reviews and lots of rejection. How?? I am shaking just thinking of it. That's why I never post anything and couldn't even contemplate sharing any of this first draft with anyone. I would have to work and work on it before I could even send it to an editor. It's kind of like the people who clean their houses till they gleam because the cleaner's coming round that day! I would love to know where authors get their confidence from. Sharon, I can completely see where you are coming from. It took me quite a lot to post that short story on the blog yesterday. Even though I only wrote it quickly and to show characterisation, I still didn't feel that confident. Then this morning I woke up to find that someone had sent me a very long critique of it, basically ripping it to shreds and now my confidence has been knocked. So, I don't know if I'm the best person to give advice as I am exactly the same as you! Can anyone else give any advice to Sharon? Don't let them shake you. You have a gift, and depending on what they said, they could be jealous, or maybe they genuinly wanted to help fix the 'flaws' they saw. They missed the point of why you posted that though. Take everything in stride. Turn what they did on their head. If they offered anything beneficial, use it? But don't take it to heart because you are a great writer.
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Post by ottabelle on Dec 9, 2011 19:01:39 GMT
Thanks for the sending to editor advice, Kate. And I think you're right about support. Before here, before posting on the blog, I really ever only showed things I wrote to one friend online and family. Neither of who were supporting the way I wanted. I was too bull headed to either stop writing or stop showing them. Now, I don't show them as much and I write more than ever. And I'm so sad that they got to Beth.
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Post by sharon2306 on Dec 10, 2011 23:32:45 GMT
[quote author=madrye board=questions thread=23 post=201 time=1323433828Sharon, it is natural to not feel confident when you're starting out with something like this. Writing is like baring your soul. It's extremely tough to do. But you have to make a conscious decision that you are going to do it because you love it. You will withstand the bad reviews and the rejections and the negativity. You will try harder and learn more and write better. You have to truly believe in yourself. Because you are the only one who makes it happen, in the end. Trust me, it does get easier. I swear to you that it does. But you absolutely have to have the determination and the perseverence to get through the rocky times. It also helps to have a wonderful support group cheering you on. Anyway, that's me chiming in. [/quote] Thanks so much for that! You are absolutely right. Today, I had some amazingly positive experiences that made me think something or someone is pushing me on in this endeavour! Firstly, I visited my mother and "confessed" that I had finished the first draft of a novel. As she has been urging me to do this for years she was over the moon and wanted to read it. I promised her that when I am happy with the edit she can be the first to read it. I also decided to send a copy at the same time to my daughter in law who reads the kind of books I have written and would be able to judge how it fares alongside others in the genre and if it has any promise at all. Then my daughter offered me her netbook. I had been thinking about getting one for several reasons. Firstly I would not connect to the internet with it at all so it would not be a distraction unlike my laptop. Secondly, my laptop could then stay in my bedroom as it is quite big and bulky and I could carry a netbook around with me to write whenever I wanted. Thirdly, it is another way of backing up the novel as I don't currently have an external hard drive so this would be useful. The next thing that happened was that I got a very unexpected cheque from the Inland Revenue for overpayment in tax. This means not only that I can finish Christmas shopping without tearing my hair out, but also I can buy the desk and chair, bookcases and filing cabinet that I have been promising myself for when my daughter moves out next month and I finally get my own writing room! It also leaves enough to enrol on a home study writing course with Writers' News which I have been longing to do for a while but couldn't afford. Amazingly, I then went into town to do some shopping and wandered into Waterstones to buy my mum a copy of Val Wood's Harbour Girl for Christmas and Val Wood herself was only sitting there doing a booksigning! I didn't even know so that was a real surprise and I got a book signed for my mum and told her we were all fans of hers and she was really nice so I came out feeling like this was quite possibly the best day ever. ;D
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Post by loupy on Dec 10, 2011 23:36:56 GMT
Wow Sharon that sounds like an amazing day!
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Post by sharon2306 on Dec 10, 2011 23:38:19 GMT
Beth I think you're amazing, not only for posting what that person said but for taking it all on the chin and sharing with us! I think you are right to be so positive. I know that there is no way that EVERYBODY will like my book. I will be over the moon if just one person tells me they loved it. I really, really want to do this so I am going to have to get over the sensitivity. One thing I have noticed from this forum and from all the authors and bloggers and agents etc that I follow on Twitter is that the writing community, in general, is very supportive of its members. Authors are always encouraging and publicising other writers' work and I find that really lovely. The people on this forum have already been so kind and positive that I feel much better and braver already, and I've only been a member for a couple of days. I know some days will be harder than others, and some days I'll wish I'd never mentioned my book to anyone, but mostly I feel that I will succeed in one way or another. Thanks to all of you for all your support and advice. I really appreciate it.
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